Episode #45: Parenting Highly Sensitive Children and Managing Big Emotions with Dr. Genevieve von Lob

A compassionate conversation on navigating emotional overwhelm and supporting both HSP children and parents through big feelings.

Welcome back to The Happy HSP Podcast. I’m your host Kimberly Marshall, and today I’m joined by clinical psychologist, conscious parenting coach, and author Dr. Genevieve von Lob. We talk about how highly sensitive children experience the world, why disciplining them often backfires, and what young HSPs actually need when it comes to navigating big emotions.

So, if you’re raising a highly sensitive child and you’re not sure how to respond to their intensity and meltdowns, or maybe you’re wondering whether or not you’re doing something “wrong,” then this episode is for you.

I hope you enjoy it!

Kim: Dr. Genevieve, it is so great to see you. Thank you for joining me today.

Genevieve: It’s such a joy to be here with you, Kimberly. Thank you for having me on the podcast.

Kim: Absolutely. Same here. So, my question for you first is how you originally found out you had high sensitivity and what that trait was and what that journey was like for you.

Genevieve: So, I first understood and found out about high sensitivity actually through my work as a clinical psychologist. So, I was working in child and adolescent mental health services, which is in the British National Health Service. And I was working with all sorts of children, referred children who were having behavioral issues, emotional issues, anxiety, eating issues. I mean, you name it, I was seeing all of these children, and many of them were coming in with question marks, whether they had various diagnoses. 

And my work is really to get to the bottom of what’s going on with these kids. And this is about a decade ago, and I was seeing so many children and they didn’t fit neatly into diagnostic boxes, but they did have this quality. So, what I was noticing with them was they had this presence. Many of them had a kind of wisdom, like what I used to see them as old souls, and they had such deep empathy.

And some of them would come in talking about their empathy for the planet, for animals. Some of them had such a strong sense of fairness and justice. And I was like, “There’s something about these children, but I can’t work out what it is.” 

So I went, as you do as a psychologist, I went researching and I came across a talk on YouTube by Gabor Maté talking about stressed parents and stressed children. And he mentioned the orchid children. And that led me to Thomas Boyce, who’s an American pediatrician. His book called The Orchid and the Dandelion. And he talked about how the orchid children are these very highly sensitive children who are very reactive to their environment. And like the orchid flower, if they’re not in an environment that suits them, they wither. But when they’re in the environment that really supports them, really sees them, really nurtures them, they can really flourish.

So, I was really interested by this. And then you will know Dr. Elaine Aron, I found her work and her book. I started off actually with The Highly Sensitive Child and read that and thought, That’s it. These children are highly sensitive. They are deep processors. They have finely tuned nervous systems. They are processing many of them on a sensory level, noises, sound, light, color. And some of them had such deep empathy and were obviously picking up on the emotions in a room of teachers, of parents. I called them tuning forks because I would see these children, and I’d think they like scanning everything. 

They’re very perceptive, noticing small details. And this was a real aha moment for me because why I liked high sensitivity as a framework is it wasn’t saying that there was anything wrong with the children. We weren’t pathologizing them. And that’s what, for me at that time, seeing every child being labeled with something, I felt was communicating to them, there’s something wrong with you rather than looking holistically, looking at the environment and looking at temperament.

And so that was a real ... Yeah. And then that really helped my work from then on because then I was seeing children in terms of high sensitivity. And of course, so many of the kids that I see are highly sensitive. 

And then as I went on and I thought, “Ah, this is me,” because I didn’t immediately resonate with it. So the word sensitive, I didn’t see myself as a sensitive person. I thought I don’t cry. I’m not a wallflower. I think I saw it as a weakness initially, but as I learned more about the trait, I realized that I’d actually learned lots of strategies and ways to cope with my sensitivity and that I actually was a very deeply intense feeler. I’d just numbed out when I was young because of kind of early trauma, early loss. My mom died when I was young, and I think I felt so much that I numbed it all and suppressed it.

So, as I’ve done more work on myself, more healing, I’ve unlocked more and I feel more. But I absolutely, if I do that HSP quiz, I tick every box. I mean, I’ve quite all of it. 

Kim: Extreme. 10 out of 10, 10 out of 10. 

Genevieve: That’s definitely me. And I’ve done the new one as well. Have you done the new quiz? 

Kim: I looked at it briefly.

Genevieve: Yeah. Yeah. I rated it very high on that. And I like the new one because it kind of includes more of the positive traits as well, because of course there’s so many gifts to this trait and that’s what I’ve learned over the last decade is yes, there are struggles, but there are also so many benefits to being highly sensitive.

Kim: Yes, so many. And that’s why I love a lot of the work that professionals like you are doing. It’s more of a celebration of the trait and an understanding rather than when those kids are coming to you. I’m sure their parents were at their wits end thinking something’s wrong with these kids. Can you take me through that, what that was like to maybe kind of explain what do parents first see with their children and how do you help them shape what’s actually going on here?

Genevieve: Yeah, such a good question, Kimberly, because what parents see is behavior. They see defiance, they see a child who’s resistant, who’s having a meltdown, who’s crying, so they see the intensity. And of course, so many parents are triggered by that because it’s a lot to hold. And understandably, it’s very difficult to deal with a child who’s that intense and has that much depth. And they do, a lot of the highly sensitive children I see do have these extreme meltdowns, especially when they’re younger. 

And I think they’re also very challenging, actually, for many parents because what it does is it takes the parent then on their own journey often because they realize that, or they may realize at some point that they’re highly sensitive because this is a genetic trait. And so, the child is directly mirroring them. And I think for many parents, it’s very challenging because so many parents didn’t get seen, they were misunderstood, they weren’t listened to, they weren’t witnessed, their emotions and their intensity and their depth wasn’t given permission.

So, actually, it’s quite triggering when your child is in front of you showing you all of that feeling and speaking up and they’re such truth tellers. It’s very confronting for parents.

Kim: Right. And it’s almost like if they haven’t healed that part in themselves or don’t understand high sensitivity in themselves, they’re almost reacting to the kid having the meltdown, and it’s like both of them are melting down and kind of exacerbating the situation, I would assume. And for the child, that’s especially confusing, I would guess.

Genevieve: Yeah, that’s exactly what happens in these dynamics. And of course, highly sensitive parents get overstimulated more quickly. So parenting is a very overstimulating thing to do. Having another child, raising a child, it’s very overstimulating. 

Kim: Interesting. I didn’t know that.

Genevieve: Role…

Kim: Can you explain that?So, the parents get overstimulated more quickly, you’re saying, than the child.

Genevieve: No. A highly sensitive parent gets overstimulated more quickly than the average parent. That’s really all I’m saying. 

Kim: The average parent. Yeah. Okay. 

Genevieve: Then maybe a parent who’s less sensitive. So, the highly sensitive parent is the one that often will get triggered more. They’re the ones who then start shouting, losing their patience. It’s often the highly sensitive ones. And then going on a complete guilt trip afterwards of, why did I shout? Where was the empathy? I’m a horrible parent.

Kim: Shame.

Genevieve: Yeah. All the shame comes up. And it’s very challenging to be ... Especially when it’s a highly sensitive parent and a highly sensitive child, that is an explosive mix.

Kim: Dynamic. Right.

Genevieve: Very dynamic. Yeah.

Kim: So, you were talking about how it comes down a lot to the environment. So, can you share a little bit about the environment that maybe if an HSP parent who’s parenting an HSP child, what can they do to kind of calm the environment for the child and help the child understand what’s going on a bit more and lead them a bit more?

Genevieve: Well, there’s obviously the physical environment you can think about lighting and not having too much clutter. So, there’s those kinds of things that you can do. But I think in terms of just how you are with your child, with a highly sensitive child, what I find is a big trigger for them is feeling pressured or rushed. That’s very hard for highly sensitive children when they feel that or when there’s a transition. So, we all do, and I know as a highly sensitive person myself, I do better when I’m going slowly and not being rushed. That’s very triggering for me when I’m trying to get out of the door quickly. Yeah.

Kim: We need time to ease in…

Genevieve: Yeah. And it’s overwhelming for the highly sensitive nervous system. So, I think one of the things I always say to parents is leaving yourself enough time where possible to get ready and warnings, like don’t just warn at the last minute we’re going, like plenty, give lots of space. 

Now, I know that’s not always easy, but it does help even having everything prepared the night before. Preparation is a key with highly sensitive children. It helps everyone. And I think when they’re having their big intense emotions, like when they’re feeling overwhelmed or they’re feeling upset, often the parent wants to go in and fix it or even punish them sometimes or try and explain why they’re doing the wrong thing. And the biggest thing that I find helps a highly sensitive child is be quiet, like less stimulation, give them some space, give them space to have their emotion.

If they’re crying or they’re angry, you just hold the space. Now, you have to be calm to do that. And that’s the hard bit as a parent because they’re triggered. But if you can stay calm and just wait for the feeling, don’t talk, it’s always going to be more effective with the highly sensitive kids. They get so overstimulated by their parents’ voices.

Kim: Yes. And I think the normal reaction as a parent is discipline. We need to discipline. It’s like, but in that moment, your child needs understanding. They need to understand. They’re so aware of their emotions. And I’m just speaking from being a highly sensitive child myself. I was so aware of my emotions that when I was being punished for having these big...It was like, “What’s wrong with me? There’s something wrong with me.” And I think that strikes fear in us.

Genevieve: Yeah, I love that. That is exactly what I see in every child, every highly sensitive child. They feel like there’s something wrong with them for having these intense emotions. And I think sometimes parents don’t realize, but they reinforce that message that there is something different about the child and something not normal, and no one wants to be abnormal. 

And so, what we need to really be doing is saying, “It’s fine. Your intensity is welcomed. Your emotions are so welcome.” And that’s nothing wrong with that. And it’s fine to have that. In fact, it’s a beautiful thing to feel intensely because actually we know that you can’t have those amazing, joyful moments and those humor because the kids are so fun. 

When they’re calm and regulated, they’re often the most witty kids. They’re the ones that light up a room, and they’re often very, very popular, but you have to have some of the other emotions too, which is the anger, the low moments, the sadness.

It’s like you can’t have one without the other. But I think normalizing all of this intensity and these deep emotions is something that parents can really do and validating how they’re feeling.

Kim: Right.And then when you found out you were highly sensitive, you mentioned...It’s so funny to me that a lot of psychologists that I speak to that do kind of find the HSP trait through their work originally, like you said, we’re trying to find answers for their clients. How can I help these kids? How can I help my clients? And then start understanding it’s part of us. But I love that you mentioned at first you kind of distance yourself from that word sensitive. It’s just so funny to me because you’re seeing it in the kids, but we refuse to see it in ourselves.

Can you just share a little bit about that journey and what it felt like to understand that was speaking to you, how that kind of shifted your perspective?

Genevieve: It’s such a good question. And it is something that so many of us go through. I think this journey of rejecting that word. And I know that Dr. Elaine Aron has also said it wasn’t the best word, but she couldn’t think of anything else at the time. 

Kim: Sure. 

Genevieve: And I don’t know. I mean, for me, I prefer thinking of myself as a deep processor and deeply feeling maybe, rather than sensitive. I still struggle with that word, but I love the framework. So, I think the framework really determines. That’s the magic. And once I understood the framework and I went through the DOES, there’s the depth of processing. Yes, I tick that. Definitely a deep processor, deep feeler, deeply thinking person, and often very philosophical, psychological, very interested in spirituality. Then the O, the overstimulation, I thought, yep, I ticked that. I’ve definitely been very overstimulated in many areas of my life and have learned ways to manage it now, and I cope much better with it these days.But when I was younger, I really didn’t manage my overwhelm very well. 

The E, the empathy, I have so much empathy. I almost think I’ve been overempathic in my life and felt too much of everyone else’s emotion. So, I’ve had to learn my own boundaries and how to stay with my own experience and have a boundary around not taking everyone else’s stuff because I see highly sensitive people can be those sponges. So it’s a journey of learning the boundary. 

And the S, separation and the S, the sensitivity to subtle stimuli, like being a deep noticer, I really definitely resonated with that of seeing detail. I see patterns. I’m a big picture thinker. I always have been very visionary. So, I think it was when I learned more about the trait and I did the Dr. Elain Aron training so that I could become a knowledgeable therapist.

So, I’m listed on her website as an HSP knowledgeable therapist. And so, I learned more then. And then I just read about the trait, I listened to YouTube videos, I read the research, and I guess it was just a process of, yeah, that’s me. That’s definitely me. 

Kim: That’s kind of cool. 

Genevieve: Definitely me. 

Kim: When I explain what I do and I say I’m a highly sensitive person, I’m with you. You can feel the little bit of resistance to the person in front of you because you know what they’re thinking. You know they’re thinking the emotionally reactive and I’m so fragile, but I always love to start with the sensory and the environment part, like how we take in our environment so deeply and the processing and the intelligence. 

Because to your point, when you do dig into the research, it’s like kind of cool. You kind of want to be part of this club. All the poets and the philosophers and the deep thinkers and the deep feelers, there’s so much color to this trait. They’re like, Hell yeah, I love music and yeah, I cry at movies, but that’s just because I feel it so deeply in my soul.

Genevieve: Yeah, I love that. It’s beautiful. And yeah, it’s the creative as well, the creative part. I mean, I’ve always loved music, connect deeply with music and I am a musician as well. And so that’s another part of who I am and my trait. And I feel like music comes through me, and it’s such an amazing part of the trait because I also did acting as a child and singing and dance. And I think you’ll find so many HSPs in the arts and the creative world and writers. And it is, it’s a great club, not to say ... Yeah. I’m always very, very careful not to say it’s not a special club, but I think it’s important for us to have this club because many of us have felt very alone. We felt very misunderstood and we felt stigmatized against. And I think for many of us, it’s quite lonely and different.

So, I think it’s important for us to find each other, find our tribe.

Kim: Yeah. And I love that distinction. I agree with you. Sometimes it can feel like we’re saying we’re better than everyone else and we have this and that’s not it. It is a gift, but in a way that we can be more loving and accepting of ourselves and really just shine in who we are. And sometimes we do, we need that permission. And I think it’s so valuable to see another highly sensitive person who is standing in their power, who is standing in their sovereignty, who is comfortable with who they are. It’s like, wait, I don’t have to be self-conscious. I don’t have to hide who I am, kind of gives you that kind of feeling like I want to be comfortable in my own skin.

Genevieve: Yeah. I love that. I love what you just said, everything you just said, and I completely resonated because I think what this highly sensitive person framework has done for me has led me down a path of self-acceptance, really accepting myself fully. And I think until that point, I was still struggling with self-worth issues, feeling different and suddenly I made sense of myself, and I could fully start to step into that sovereignty you talk about empowerment. And I think an empowered HSP is just such a force to be reckoned with.

Kim: It’s a beautiful thing. I remember the same thing because when I first found out, I got pregnant at 19, so I was very young when I had my daughter. She’s 23 now, which is absolutely insane. But I found out in the earlier years, probably about six or seven years after Dr. Elain Aron published her book by synchronicity, by divine timing. I walked into a bookstore out searching for answers. 

My family was coming down really hard on me and thinking I had mental health issues. And I’m sorry, I don’t want to get ... I still have my first copy of the book. And I just remember highlighting, underlining, there’s nothing wrong with me. I’m totally fine. I knew it. I’m going through something really difficult and I’m having a strong emotional reaction. Everything’s okay. So yeah, I mean, sensitivity or not, whether or not that’s the right word, it’s helped so many people.

Genevieve: Yeah. You can’t argue with that. And thank you for sharing. And this is what I love about HSPs is even now as I speak to you, I just felt so moved by you as I felt your emotion. And I think this is one of the things that we share when we connect with another HSP is that we can actually just let go of the masks and just be ourselves and don’t be ashamed of our emotion and when we need to tear up and cry.

Kim: Yeah, yeah.

Genevieve: And that’s something about…

Kim: We appreciate authenticity.

Genevieve: We appreciate authenticity and realness. And sometimes in the world, we can’t find that and we look for it and then we try and fit into these groups of friends or into systems. And we pretend, we become like the chameleons and we shapeshift. And I think HSPs are very good at shapeshifting and fitting to what they need to be because we’re so socially aware and can attune to situations, but we’re not being ourselves. And that feels like a real tension. And I know this because I speak from experience of trying to be different people in my life and trying on different masks, right?

Kim: Yeah. That’s exactly it. It’s the masks. And it’s a protective thing because I don’t know about you, but I always felt like, oh, they’re so self-assured in the world they must know all the answers. They must know how to be. Let me be that way in the corporate world. Let me be cutthroat. Let me do everything I can for my job and sacrifice all my time. And we just have a different way. Yeah, we just have a different way about us.

Genevieve: Different way, different energy. And I think we have just seriously as a group of people struggled with our way. And you said, yeah, and being truly who we are, our authentic selves, we’ve kept pushing that parts of ourselves down. 

And also, you talked about the corporate world. I mean, HSPs struggle in those kinds of systems. We really struggle cutthroat. It doesn’t suit how we are to be competitive, trying to get one over on other people. And I know many HSPs, because I’ve worked with many HSB clients who’ve tried it, and so often they burn out or they have a depressive episode or they break down because it’s kind of against who they really are.

Kim: Yeah, against our grain and our nature. I know because I was in career coaching. Now I’m more in the spiritual realm with energy because it’s all connected, I’m sure you’re up on that. But yes, that was my experience. And then you also try to figure out what is wrong with me. Why can’t I do this? Why do I keep burning out? Why do my coworkers, why are they excelling and getting promotions? I’m so smart. I know this stuff and I’m trying so hard. Yeah, it’s just not always for us, and that’s okay.

Genevieve: Yeah. And I think as HSPs, we actually do struggle sometimes with visibility in these kinds of places. We struggle with actually finding our true voice and speaking up for ourselves. And we often sort of suppress. So we know that we’re as good as everyone else, but we struggle to actually, because we’re processing and thinking deeply and because we think so much and then we’re picking up on all the subtle cues in the room and the energies.

I think for me anyway, that used to throw me all the energies I can feel and then I start getting into my head. And I had this severe performance anxiety. I really struggled with public speaking. That was one of my biggest struggles is actually speaking authentically. And I remember being in work meetings and you know when you have to introduce yourself in a work meeting, I’m that person where my heart was beating, I was rehearsing what I was going to say.

And then when it got to my turn, I’d be that one who’s like stuttering, can’t get my words out. And I’m like, oh, beating myself up because I never felt like I was showing myself in my best light because anxiety took over my mind. And I find this is true for so many HSPs that we can get so into our heads and overthink and worry about how we’re being perceived. And then not only that, but picking up on so much energy and data and micro-expressions on people’s faces and all of that, that we then struggle to be ourselves. And I think often it’s a thing of safety as well. We don’t feel safe because…

Kim: Exactly. It feels like my consciousness left my body whenever you come to me because yeah, I couldn’t be present in the moment. I couldn’t listen to what everyone was saying because I was so worried about how was I going to say, how is I going to come off? I have to rehearse this in my head. Oh my God, it has to be perfect. 

And not only that, but it was hard with everyone shouting out answers and thinking I wasn’t smart enough. And it’s like we excel with being able to sit with something and think about it from every angle. We just have a different way of approaching these things, which I wish I would’ve known, but you live and learn. It’s just the way that we’re made. And I guess it’s all about just learning about that and knowing it and feeling more comfortable in who you are, actually who you are.

Genevieve: Exactly. And this is why I love my work. I still work with young people. I work with teenagers and most of them are highly sensitive. And I feel like it’s such a privilege to be able to be on the journey with them, witness them earlier and give them these messages that actually I wish I’d received. I wish I’d had someone normalize who I was and my feelings and my depth and the time I take to process because that would’ve actually changed so much, I think, of my life to just be normalized and witnessed. 

So, it is a tremendous privilege to be able to hold that space for young people because they come in and they’re full of angst and they want to belong and they’ve got so much depth of feeling and just to have that seen witness felt and normalized and also to give them the framework of high sensitivity.

Kim: That’s beautiful because you’re helping them in those formative years develop who they are versus what we had to go through, which is fighting who we are, fighting who we are, and now we’re in the process of taking off the masks. Yeah. Yeah. It’s been a bit different.

Genevieve: It takes years. It takes years to heal what’s the wounding and the traumas from that, doesn’t it? It takes years to take off the masks, and I’m still doing it. I’m still taking off masks. I’m still healing my frozen layers and the wounding that I got from not being really witnessed and understood.

Kim: So, what would you say you still struggle with when it comes to your high sensitivity? What’s a challenge for you?

Genevieve: There’s less challenge these days because I feel like I have designed my whole life around my temperament now. I really do. So, a few years ago, I would’ve been listing all the problems I had, all the struggles. I mean, the struggle that I have is doing too much, overscheduling, but I actually nowadays, I’ve learned so much that I can’t do the same amount as everyone else. I have to take my life slower. It’s just necessary. Otherwise, I become anxious, I become overwhelmed, I become drained, and I’m not a very nice person to be around.

Kim: Same.

Genevieve: So, slowness. I’m not saying I get this right, by the way, perfectly. I mean, there are times, especially when you’re a mom, and there’s no such thing as perfection, even though I’m a psychologist and I help people, I’m just human as well, and I have my moments of getting overstimulated and triggered in parenting. But I do find that if I can create more slowness in the day and less stuff packed in, and I don’t do lots of socializing so much these days. And I think for me, that was probably a struggle, like in my 20s and even my 30s.

So, I really select...If I do socialize, it’s very much selective, quality, usually HSPs, HSP friends. And I think in terms of the kind of speaking now, you see, again, that was a real struggle for me, the visibility and the public speaking, but I have just practiced and learned how to drop out of my head more into my heart and my body. And I’ve just done things like this, podcasts and spoken more. And I think over time, the more you do it and the more you feel safe and the more you practice and the more you drop out of here, the easier it actually becomes to speak. I mean, I used to go to groups and community groups, and I’d be the quiet one in the circle. I just couldn’t speak. And now I run retreats and I co-facilitate a retreat in Devon, an annual one for HSPs.

And when we speak to people and introduce, because we have a sharing circle, it’s very much like an invitation to speak. You don’t have to speak. We understand HSPs. Both Jules and I, who I co-facilitate with, have been on this journey of struggling to speak in front of people. So, we very much support people and say it’s an invitation to speak. But if you want to try and practice, there really is no judgment from us because we get it. We really understand. And we’re really not. It’s the place. And we’re really not judging if you stumble on your words, if you feel like you talk too much. So, I think that the main...I mean, it’s very difficult to say that the others...I’m trying to think of other struggles. I think my biggest struggle as an HSP now would be any situation where there’s small talk, actually.

I really notice-

Kim: Check out. Yeah.

Genevieve: I really struggle. And I don’t know. I just find it very hard to just talk about things like the weather, which British people, we love to talk about the weather here. I don’t know about in America, but I find that actually really draining to keep things on a surface level. And what I find is when I actually have a deep talk, even if it’s about pain or it’s things that are very sad or distressing, I somehow feel more energized by topics which feel deeper because I guess it feels more real and more authentic. 

Whereas to me, when I’m speaking on a superficial level, I feel like I’m having to keep parts of myself hidden, and I feel contracted. So yeah, I struggle with anything which is like shallow about gossip, celebrity. It’s not my thing really. 

Kim: Can’t do gossip. 

Genevieve: Can’t do gossip. 

Kim: I don’t do gossip. It just doesn’t.

Genevieve: Yeah. Don’t do gossip. Doesn’t feel good.

Kim: It doesn’t.

Genevieve: It’s awful. Doesn’t feel good. Yeah. I don’t think it’s good to talk about people and gossip. And it doesn’t interest me.

Kim: Yeah.

Genevieve: Yeah.

Kim: It feels gross. Yeah. I’m with you.

Genevieve: Yeah. Yeah. So, I guess the main things I struggle with these days, what I’m saying is that I have actually done a lot of work on my struggles, but I still have moments where I get very dysregulated and overwhelmed. If there’s too much going on, if things are built up when I’m tired, and if my daughter is in a difficult place, if she’s in a bad mood, and I’m struggling to hold the space for her if I don’t have capacity for her. So, motherhood is probably my ongoing struggle, really, to be honest. And it always will be, I think.

Kim: Yeah.

Genevieve: Being a mother.

Kim: Oh yeah. Being a mom is so tough. Isn’t it funny? It’s like you think you can be friends and then...I don’t know. How old’s your daughter, did you say?

Genevieve: She’s eight years old.

Kim: Eight. Yeah. Mine’s 23, like I said before. It’s a different ballgame. Now she’s an adult. I can’t say anything. She doesn’t listen to me anyway. But yeah, it’s tough. 

But to your point, when you do the healing, and again, when you’re confident in who you are, it’s like you’re not fighting that part anymore. It’s like the maintenance, the day-to-day, the stuff that you’re in. But who you are, the confidence comes with the healing, thankfully.

Genevieve: It does. It does. It’s the healing work that’s essential. And I think for HSPs, we’re naturally drawn to healing work anyway. I think we naturally go that way. And I think it’s often when we have crisis, a real tough time, it’s the HSPs who find their way. You think, “I’ve got to do something about this terrible anxiety or the dread or whatever you’re feeling.” 

And I think that for me was where I got to a tipping point of I need to do something because I’m really struggling. Mine was anxiety, burnout, overwhelm, and a very busy mind. And I just got to the point where I’ve got to go on a journey. I mean, I didn’t think I consciously knew that. I look back and say I went on a journey, but I think I was just desperate for anything to sort of soothe the feelings, the intensity of ... And it was really stopping my functioning.

Kim: Yeah. Can you just share a tiny bit of your idea of healing? I would just love to hear your perspective on that. How would you describe healing?

Genevieve: So, I mean, I was drawn to psychology initially, I think because it’s about healing. But for me, psychology was like my, let’s say kindergarten step. It’s like my first step into healing. I was in my 20s and I trained as a psychologist and it’s talk therapy. So, it’s quite in the head and it was good for me to talk. 

But really where my real healing came was when I started to find more embodied practices. So, that was through things like finding meditation, somatic therapies. I went to a sweat lodge. I found shamanic ceremonies, sound healing. Honestly, Kimberly, you name it. I’ve tried everything to heal myself because I felt a responsibility as well as a space holder and a psychologist to heal myself because I couldn’t really, with good conscience, sit in front of people and feel like I’m not doing my own inner work.

So, for me, it’s been very much about getting more embodied because I think for many of us, we’re very in our heads and we’re very in this rumination and HSPs get very into these ruminative cycles.

Analyzing. So, for processing go over and over things. And that was very much me. And I couldn’t feel my body, but over time, I feel like I’ve landed more into my body. And you mentioned energies as well, and I think energetic work. So, energy work, frequency, working with energies. 

Kim: It’s all connected.

Genevieve: It’s all connected. And I’m doing more work at the moment on my ancestral lineage at the moment. So sort of connecting more with ancestors. Yes. Because we know that intergenerational trauma exists. We inherit…

Kim: It’s passed down genetically.

Genevieve: Genetically down through the lines. So well, we don’t just inherit trauma. We inherit gifts as well. I always like to remember that. It’s also resources. It’s also good things. But yeah, we have also taken our lower trauma. Yeah. We’ve got our baggage. Come down. We’ve got our baggage. Yeah. Yeah. So, it’s such a broad range of healing modalities. But for me now, I think it’s really, I’ve come back to simplicity. I’ve done lots of different types of healing, but I guess my main types would now be quiet space like meditation. I love sound. I love to sing, and that really helps to connect me. I have also some crystal balls, which I play on retreats as well, and I just love frequencies. For me, that takes me totally out of my head and into a much more grounded state of consciousness and nature. Of course, being in nature is the way that we get out of our heads again.

I think it’s always trying to get out of the head, isn’t it? Into the body. Yeah.

Kim: We’re so separated from our natural presence, but the conversations are changing. I see so much more about frequency, energy, spiritualism. It’s a welcome change. We were so caught up in technology and yeah, we’re missing that natural part of ourselves, and it is healing. And even the science on frequency and sound, how that’s healing and cellular level, I mean, that’s a whole other conversation, but yeah, there’s a lot to it. And yeah, I’m glad that more people are talking about it because it’s important.

Genevieve: Yeah. And I think many of us have been spiritual for a long time and very into energies and frequencies, but we’ve kept it to ourselves. We’ve been in the closet. That’s certainly me.

Kim: To be weird, even weirder.

Genevieve: In the closet. But now, you’re the weirdo. But now it’s like, oh, it’s actually acceptable to talk about these things now and people aren’t going to judge me in the same way. So little by little, even I have started talking more about something that has been a part of my life for a long, long time and has been a resource for me, a bit of woo.

Kim: It’s refreshing. What do you love about high sensitivity? What would you say is your favorite part about the trait?

Genevieve: Oh, that’s a great question. Wow. I think my favorite part of the trait is our ability, my ability to connect with another human, like to deeply connect and not just emotionally, psychologically and philosophically, but what we were talking about spiritually and on that kind of frequency. And I love it when I see HSPs together because when we get together, it’s like we’re on the same wavelength and suddenly it’s like a group of people and they go, “Oh wow, it’s like I found my people.” And it’s just not draining. It’s really a joy to be here. And I’m talking about deep things and they’re not looking at me like I’m weird. 

So, I love being able to connect. And I think my favorite part of the trait is being able to be authentic in my relationships with people and to be with people in their intense emotions with their struggle, their pain and their joy.

And I think another thing I love about the trait is our intuition. I feel like my intuitive abilities have always been there since I was a child. I could always sense things. I feel like I had that access to that other sense, that sixth sense. I could perceive things. It’s almost like I had more information, more data, and I think this is what the highly sensitive children have. I think they’ve got more data available to them. So, some of them see more color or they hear things. They can be clairsentient or clairvoyant. If you’ve seen the listen to The Telepathy Diaries, some children have that ability to kind of pick up. And I believe that we all have this capacity, and I think HSPs access it naturally. And I think when we can come out of our heads and into our bodies and into our hearts, we can really feel into fields like the field of someone.

And for me, that’s what I’m learning more and more is to refine that skill and to really trust it as well. Because I think one of the things we don’t do as HSPs, we often don’t trust our intuition and the data that’s coming in. But as you become more in touch with it and you start to feel it, and you know how it feels, you can 100% trust your intuition. You just know. And that’s how I feel these days. I know.

And I don’t have any doubts.

Kim: Yeah. And we’re so energetically muddied and we haven’t been taught how to develop these skills, but to your point, we have them, and then we suppress them. But again, that’s another thing that’s becoming more of a topic of conversation is how to clear your energetic field so you can start receiving these things more. And it’s just a beautiful, beautiful thing. And we have, our heightened senses are part of that. It’s just something that’s part of us, which is cool. Yeah.

Genevieve: It is cool. And absolutely when we ground it as well, because I think for some of us and me, I totally have floated...In my earlier years, floated off into bliss realms and then we become a bit bypassy.

Kim: 100%. But to your point, it’s cool and it’s like, whoa, these crazy things are happening like, oh my gosh, but it’s a natural part of who we are.

Genevieve: It is. It’s natural.

Kim: So yeah, it needs to be naturalized. It needs to be talked about more, I would say.

Genevieve: Absolutely. Talked about, normalized. And for children to learn that these are normal, because I’ve worked with kids and teenagers, and they’ll come in and they’ll tell me what they’ve experienced, and they feel so scared about it. And it’s like, no, that’s fine. That’s like an ability you’ve got. That’s a gift that you’re seeing things and hearing things. 

Kim: Hearing things like that’s normal. Yeah. Yeah. Lean into that. Thinkabout what that’s telling you and that’s awesome. What would you say to highly sensitive people who may be struggling with their trait? What would you offer as maybe some advice or encouragement?

Genevieve: I would say there’s nothing wrong with you and you’re not broken and don’t compare yourself with anyone else because we’re all on our own different paths. We’ve all got our own gifts and our own struggles. And I think for many highly sensitive people, they often reach a point in their lives where they’re really struggling. The old ways of coping are not working anymore, and they’ve tried to kind of fit in with the mainstream. And I think that can be a wake-up call. It’s often the crisis, right? We said about the dark night of the soul, the point where you don’t know where you’re going and what’s going on and you feel helpless. So, I’d really encourage HSPs if you’re really struggling with that at the moment, with your purpose and knowing where your meaning is, to have trust and to have faith, that there may be something that comes out of this dark time.

It may not feel like it right now, but often these are the moments that become initiations for us, and we may not be able to see the way, but it will become clearer. And I would say if you think you’re an HSP, which I think most people listening to this podcast are, is to just learn as much as you can about the trait, listen to the podcasts, read the books, really go on that path of understanding it, because that’s what’s going to help you to accept yourself. 

And when we accept ourselves, then we start to connect more with our intuition, and this is what we’re talking about with this journey of empowerment. So yeah, what else would I say? Yes. My final thing I would say is find community, find your tribe, find the others, because if you felt alone and isolated, there are others like you out there.

You just have to find them and they are there. And however that community presents itself, maybe it’s a walking group, maybe it’s a choir, but just find a tribe of people where you feel safe to be more of yourself because as highly sensitive people, we deserve that. We deserve to be more of ourselves, to be our authentic selves.

Kim: Beautiful. Genevieve, thank you so much for sharing all this. What a pleasure to speak with you today. I’m so glad we got to connect.

Genevieve: Me too, Kimberly. It’s been really so lovely to be in conversation with you. I’ve really enjoyed this. Thank you so much. 

Kim: Before I let you go, can you share with us about the retreats where people can find your retreats and more about ... You mentioned you were working on a newsletter, two newsletters.

Genevieve: I have a newsletter called the HSP Revolution because I do believe that we need the revolution as HSPs, that’s why I named it that. And I’ve actually got a whole backlog of newsletters going back years. So, if you’re quite new to HSP, then this is a really useful library of information. I also write a newsletter specifically for parents called The Resonant Parenting Project. You can find me on Instagram as well, so just look me up on there. And also I run or co-facilitate a retreat in June, this June. This is the fourth one, actually. We run it annually and I can co-facilitate it with Jules DeVito and then we have a wider team. And it’s in a beautiful place in Devon in the UK in nature, which is what we love as HSPs. And we have designed this retreat around the highly sensitive person’s nervous system.

So, it’s not something that’s packed full of activities. Although we have activities.  

Kim: You get your time.

Genevieve: Yeah. You get your time to hang out, go and read a book and there’s loads of nooks and crannies to sit. There’s no pressure, but we offer a daily yoga session, which is again, very much designed for the highly sensitive person’s nervous system. No pushing, no competitive yoga here.

Kim: Yeah, no competitive.

Genevieve: Yeah. Gentle, very gentle. And you just do what you can do. We have gentle breathwork, we have gentle dance, we have singing, we have fire sitting around the fire. What else do we have? And many embodied practices. And the biggest thing is just coming together and sharing and connection with other like-minded souls. That’s really what it’s all about. 

Kim: The connection. 

Genevieve: It’s connection and making friends and feeling there’s others like us. It’s very powerful. So thank you for letting me share that.

Kim: Yeah. And video of the fire and the guitar playing. It just looks really beautiful and serene.

Genevieve: Yeah.

Kim: Yeah. Right up our alley.

Genevieve: Right? Yeah. Right off our alley. So, if anyone is interested in that, they can email us at hspretreat@gmail.com if you want more information. Yeah. 

Kim: Amazing. 

Genevieve: You can find it on my Instagram as well.

Kim: Awesome. Thank you so much again.

Genevieve: Thank you, Kimberly.

Thank you so much for listening in on my conversation with Genevieve. I hope it reminds you that if you’re parenting an HSP child and feeling overwhelmed at times, you are absolutely not alone. A gentle reminder to be kind to yourself as you make space not only for your child’s big emotions, but for yours, too. We are all learning and navigating at our own pace, and the hiccups can be honored alongside the successes. It’s all part of the journey.

Until next time. Take care!

About Dr. Genevieve von Lob

Dr. Genevieve is a clinical psychologist, conscious parenting coach, and author. She spent 15 years working in the NHS, private practice on Harley Street, and within large corporations, and is the author of two parenting books published by Penguin.

She is a leading expert on Highly Sensitive Children and recently contributed to a training module for teachers on high sensitivity developed by researchers at the University of Surrey. She also works one-to-one with Highly Sensitive People, with a particular focus on supporting them through bullying and trauma.

Genevieve regularly advocates for greater understanding of high sensitivity in the media, with appearances on BBC Woman’s Hour, Channel 4, and in The Guardian. She has a deep passion for community and healing, and co-facilitates retreats for HSPs, with the next one in June at Selgars Mill, Devon.

Follow along on Dr. von Lob’s journey:

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/drgenevievevonlob/

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/drgenevieve/

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About Kimberly:

Kimberly Marshall is an ICF-certified Energy and Intuition coach for highly sensitive people (HSPs) and host of The Happy HSP Podcast. After 20 years in the publishing industry working for companies like Time Inc., Monster.com, and W. W. Norton, she left her corporate career to pursue work that better suited her HSP needs. She now helps HSPs reconnect with their intuition, energy, and soul’s purpose so they can live gentle, heart-centered lives in alignment with who they truly are.

Through her work, Kimberly hopes to shed more light on the reality of living with high sensitivity and inspire more HSPs to embrace their empathetic, loving, and gentle natures.

• Hosted/produced by Kimberly Marshall

• Edited by Fonzie Try Media

• Artwork by Tara Corola